[sustran] Re: Google buses- comfort!, Japan, again, comfort, often combined with greater speed and lower cost

[mpotter]

I can certainly testify to the lure of comfort here in Japan.

Here in Kyushu, for example, I have friends who routinely leave their  
cars in the driveway to take limited express trains with names like the  
Sonic, Kamome (seagull) or the Ariake (named for a small inland sea).   
These are all electric, 140 km hr. max cruising speed trains,   
spotlessly clean,  quiet (save irritating announcements), frequent and   
on time.  If one seems to be  late better check your watch.

  They have comfortable (certainly more comfortable than what you see in  
the Google vans), plentiful seating except at the most crowded holiday  
times, and are smooth enough to read fine print without losing your  
place.  Compared with  a single driver, they are cheaper   than paying  
tolls.   Mostly they're used for  suburbs of intermediate distance and  
cities within 100 kilometers or so away from a major city.  The local  
trains are about 2/3 the price, but are slow aren't comfortable enough  
to lure people from their cars unless traffic is pretty bad, which it  
often is.  They are populated by the old and the young and the visibly  
less well off.

For lesser distances, one can choose between the smelly, jerky but very  
clean buses, in some cities the smooth, punctual but often overcrowded  
(hideously so in Tokyo at rush hour, only slightly less so in Osaka)  
subways, or the aforementioned local trains. One of the chief  
advantages of the subways and trains is that, in given situations, they  
are faster and cheaper than driving. The bus doesn't enjoy the former  
of these two advantages.  And  though longer distance buses can be  
quite comfortable, they can't compete with the better trains.

All that said, my personal choice here in Fukuoka, when distance and  
weather permit, which they often do, is the bicycle.

My point is that the Japanese system is very high quality and offers  
alternatives.  In major urban areas, for many commuters it's truly  
competitive with the automobile along most parameters. The result is  
that Japanese are both more mobile and have better access to services  
than most Americans or Europeans outside a few select cities.  And they  
have this mobility and access at a lower per capita transportation  
cost, particularly when compared to Americans. But that said, a key  
factor is that the car is much less heavily subsidized in Japan than in  
the US.  In most cities, parking is cheap, but not free, as it is in  
America where free parking, outside of major city downtowns, is almost  
considered a basic human right.

Cheers,
Mark Potter
millennium3






On Mar 18, 2007, at 1:16 AM, Carlos F. Pardo SUTP wrote:

>  Hi,
>
>  Actually, what I liked about the Google article was that it shows a  
> comfortable "public" transport arrangement, which is one of the things  
> that is few times implemented (at least in developing countries). The  
> race for high-speed and low-time-travel public transport has left us  
> in a 7personpersquaremeter situation where some of us can barely  
> breathe. Yes, it's part of the business structure and yes, it's  
> difficult to have buses where everybody can sit, read or sleep when  
> you need to lower the fare as much as possible. But we have to try and  
> do this somehow (cross-subsidies? congestion charging?), in order to  
> "pull" people from cars and "push" them to public transport. Comfort  
> is key, especially when it is one of the major reasons for which  
> people use unsustainable modes of transport (the car is sooo  
> comfortable, air conditioned, etc that users will never think of  
> another option). Please bear in mind that the majority of the  
> population can't care less about emissions or sustainable transport,  
> they just care about getting from A to B in the least time possible -  
> just themselves, nobody else in the city. Unfortunately, while we  
> should also promote sustainable transport by showing its  
> environmental, social and economic benefits, we should also work on  
> these selfish motives that drive people in the end (comfort, luxury,  
> apparent power, etc). I find this is one of the most important issues  
> we have to address in order to really promote mode shifts. We can't  
> keep thinking that people will start riding buses and bicycles just  
> because it's such a good thing for the environment! Unfortunately, at  
> least not for now.
>
>  Best regards,
> Carlos F. Pardo
> Coordinador de Proyecto- Project Coordinator
> GTZ - Proyecto de Transporte Sostenible (SUTP, SUTP-LAC)
> Cl 93A # 14-17 of 708
> Bogotá D.C., Colombia
> Tel/fax:  +57 (1) 236 2309  Mobile: +57 (3) 15 296 0662
> carlos.pardo at sutp.org   www.sutp.org
>
>
>  Todd Edelman, Green Idea Factory wrote:Hi,
>>
>> To look at this story a bit more broadly, it is about corporate and  
>> also
>> personal responsibility...
>>
>> While it is clear that it is better for employees to go by this  
>> shuttle
>> bus rather than in their own cars, the main issue is that Google and  
>> its
>> fellow Silicon Valley resident companies have their HQs in a  
>> low-density
>> area with possibly inadequate public transport to the front door. The
>> very successful CalTrain commuter railway - which goes from San
>> Francisco to Silicon Valley - is not mentioned directly.
>>
>> The sitings of these Internet behemoths was the first mistake. So now
>> everyone has to pay the price for that. And only a minority is using
>> public transport. These companies should move to denser population
>> centres - perhaps with incentives. Maybe one big facility should be
>> split, e.g. with communication between a Google North and Google South
>> done electronically or via the railway with local feeders (including
>> cycling), which should be much more efficient per passenger than  
>> using a
>> small shuttle bus.
>>
>> The greener mode of transport - I would call it "boutique public
>> transport" - which is the main focus of the article does not mention  
>> the
>> other problems with long-distance commuting, from the difficulties it
>> creates for people staying connected - physically - to the places they
>> live (including their children), and also to their colleagues. Both  
>> are
>> important, and achieving both with a motorised solution - even a kind  
>> of
>> communal one using bioDiesel (from what sources?) - is not necessarily
>> sustainable.
>>
>> In proximity,
>> T
>>
>>
>> Carlos F. Pardo SUTP wrote:
>>
>>> March 10, 2007
>>> original source:
>>> http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/10/technology/10google.html? 
>>> pagewanted=1&ei=5088&en=dcb412d03d29e1f6&ex=1331182800&partner=rssnyt 
>>> &emc=rss
>>>
>>>
>>>   Google’s Buses Help Its Workers Beat the Rush
>>>
>>> By MIGUEL HELFT
>>> <http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/h/ 
>>> miguel_helft/index.html?inline=nyt-per>
>>>
>>> MOUNTAIN VIEW, Calif. — The perks of working at Google
>>> <http://www.nytimes.com/mem/MWredirect.html?MW=http:// 
>>> custom.marketwatch.com/custom/nyt-com/html- 
>>> companyprofile.asp&symb=GOOG>
>>> are the envy of Silicon Valley. Unlimited amounts of free
>>> chef-prepared food at all times of day. A climbing wall, a volleyball
>>> court and two lap pools. On-site car washes, oil changes and  
>>> haircuts,
>>> not to mention free doctor checkups.
>>>
>>> But the biggest perk may come with the morning commute...[...]
>>>
>>>
>>
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