<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <meta content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1" http-equiv="Content-Type"> <title></title> </head> <body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000"> Daryl Oster wrote: <blockquote cite="mid200604221322.k3MDM3Lt010604@njbrsmtp1.vzwmail.net" type="cite"> <pre wrap="">If we are to use your logic and apply it to the possible benefit of cars we must calculate the health regenerative benefits of resting!</pre> </blockquote> what happens to the costs that are incurred due to resting such as obesity..I dont think riding a car is an exercise for the body if it is, then there would not have been increasing cases of obesity among car users. Car driving i believe is an addiction which kills both the driver and the other people without their knowledge. <blockquote cite="mid200604221322.k3MDM3Lt010604@njbrsmtp1.vzwmail.net" type="cite"> <pre wrap="">It is well known that someone involved in physical labor (or exercise) must sit down and rest to regenerate for optimal health -- the ride home from a job requiring physical labor could supply the needed inactivity necessary to maintain good health before they go home to eat and engage in more physical work at home by mowing the lawn, raking leaves, shoveling snow, etc. . There are many workers who have physically demanding jobs - and home lives too. In fact likely as many or more workers must physically work or walk, than have jobs with no physical demands. A bike ride demand could negatively effect the health of such a person by placing too many physical demands on the body.</pre> </blockquote> I do not agree to this statement as I have personally observed several daily labour in India who travel by a bicycle and seldom visit a doctor for the case of a heart attack or a body pain just because they work more....yes they might be a good number of the labourers dead but the death is caused by other vices like drinking and working in odd places. A car ride would also negatively effect the health of both the driver and the others on the road and the environment. <blockquote cite="mid200604221322.k3MDM3Lt010604@njbrsmtp1.vzwmail.net" type="cite"> <pre wrap="">We agree on the health benefits of moderate exercise. The benefits of cycling exercise only apply to those who would not otherwise get a sufficient amount of exercise -- such as a university professor, lawyer, or accountant, these jobs are fewer in comparison to jobs that require some or much physical effort. </pre> </blockquote> Again here, we cannot conclude that the people working in the above professions do not get enough exercise..it solely depends on their life style...I have seen in my university professors who are fat and the same time are excessively addicted to car...i mean it they use a car even to just go to the other side of the road....but i have also seen professors who are perfectly fit even at their 60's...people who drive a car IMO spend more for excercise (gym membership yata yata yata...)... <blockquote cite="mid200604221322.k3MDM3Lt010604@njbrsmtp1.vzwmail.net" type="cite"> <pre wrap=""> It is wonderful that you enjoy a healthier and happier life because you ride a bike to work. Many who now use cars could also make the same choice and enjoy the benefits you do. It is also true that many who now travel by bike would enjoy a better life if they owned a car. The chart I submitted show the biggest reasons why the car is winning the market for transportation mode, and what MUST be provided if MOST people are to be expected to change to a more sustainable mode.</pre> </blockquote> <blockquote cite="mid200604221322.k3MDM3Lt010604@njbrsmtp1.vzwmail.net" type="cite"> <pre wrap=""> I am not against biking or walking - nor am I against cars. I am simply stating the transportation facts as I see them, and as most people see them, although they may not be able to say precisely why.</pre> </blockquote> I think you have understood the reasons for car ownership in a purely economic way but there are also other reasons for car ownership like the prestige which is an increasing reason for extreme car ownership in the developing worlds...but i presume that car ownership has got nothing to do with the total VKT....there are countries with high car ownership but less ridership....again stating what Todd said if the living is scattered then there is obviously a high need to travel more like in Australia but in India high density living does not "yet" make people to travel more for basic necessities and there are still families who think twice before they plan to own a car...IMO the flexible bank loans and financial incentives are the catalysts for increased car ownership in the developing countries. I am sure that most people including myself see the other side of transportation...as said in many of the posts we dont believe that the mobility is the end but it is accessibility...we here do not want the mistakes in car owner/ridership to be repeated in the developing cities...as I guess that is the main theme of this whole discussion list...As you refer to Litman in many of your posts and even in your spreadsheet...even he in many of his publications have shown the disadvantages of car dependency. On a closing note I would like to clearly state that I have no negative comment on your project of ETT as I appreciate the innovative approach and have even mailed you off the list. But I am concerned about the costs that you place for everything in the human values....if a city is bustling with people in their city centres there cannot be any precise method to calculate the cost of their happiness and at the same time there cannot be a method to calculate when some one is lost in a car crash....though there might be an ECONOMIC way to do this, in my opinion it will not really evaluate the real happiness or grief. I might have be absolutely wrong in in this post, I will be glad to know my mistakes and would like to apologise for any such mistakes. Thanking you, Sunny </body> </html>