[sustran] Re: Tata Nano: Criminalizing Mobility orMobilizing Crime

[Lee Schipper]

Judging from the callers to the radio show I did today, Americans don't seem to grasp what Sudhir  (and others) have written, that
Indian streets are already jammed and that providing yet another cheap mode of individual motorization makes life worse for everyone  (including those stuck in their cars) more than it might enhance the well being of those inside the mini cars. In that sense the point below about cheap cars forcing two wheelers to be even cheaper is very well taken
 
 
 
Lee Schipper
EMBARQ, the WRI Center for Sustainable Transport
www.embarq.wri.org
>From Oct 1, Visiting Scholar, 
UC Transportation Center
UC Berkeley, CA 
www.uctc.net
510 642 6889
202 262 7476

________________________________

From: Sudhir [mailto:sudhir at secon.in]
Sent: Tue 1/22/2008 3:48 PM
To: Walter Hook; Lee Schipper; bruun at seas.upenn.edu; sustran-discuss at list.jca.apc.org
Subject: Re: [sustran] Re: Tata Nano: Criminalizing Mobility orMobilizing Crime


Sir,
 
Rapid Motorisation is the main cause of urban chaos in India. The problem with cars such as tata is that is is highly affordable to the Indian middle class. The middle class which generally prefer 2 wheelers would start shifting towards cars which would further increase the congestion problems. The safety is not an issue here as the car would be much safer than walking, 2 wheelers. already cities are undergoing multiple vehicle ownership phenomenon without having space to park at home/work/road.

The  public transportation would suffer further degradation as  competition would bring 2-wheeler price down in order to keep the sales.
 
One lakh car (price) would add many lakhs of vehicles on road and that is the main problem.
Regards
Sudhir 

 

 


	-----Original Message-----
	From: "Walter Hook" <whook at itdp.org>
	To: "'Lee Schipper'" <schipper at wri.org>, <bruun at seas.upenn.edu>, <sustran-discuss at list.jca.apc.org>
	Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 17:42:17 -0500
	Subject: [sustran] Re: Tata Nano: Criminalizing Mobility or Mobilizing   Crime
	
	
	I was interviewed by a few reporters on this, and I said I didn't think that
	the low cost of the vehicle was in and of itself a problem.  If the vehicle
	is not fully road worthy, crash worthy, or up to minimum tailpipe emission
	standards, those are serious social problems.  Other than this, it is great
	if the cost of vehicles goes down.  However, it will create pressure on the
	governments to charge prices that more accurately reflect the full social
	cost of the use of the vehicle, through coherent parking charges and road
	user charges.  Cheap cars do not generate any more congestion than expensive
	ones.  I suppose this was not what they wanted to hear, so maybe it wasn't
	picked up. 
	
	-----Original Message-----
	From: sustran-discuss-bounces+whook=itdp.org at list.jca.apc.org
	[mailto:sustran-discuss-bounces+whook=itdp.org at list.jca.apc.org] On Behalf
	Of Lee Schipper
	Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 3:21 PM
	To: bruun at seas.upenn.edu; sustran-discuss at list.jca.apc.org
	Subject: [sustran] Re: Tata Nano: Criminalizing Mobility or Mobilizing Crime
	
	 WE had a discussion of these issues on "On Point" , a US radio show,
	today which you
	Can hear at wbur.org. Email me if you have problems as I know where
	there is an mp3 of the 50 minute broadcast. Anumita Roychowdry of CSE
	and a Professor from MIT were also on the show and there were call ins
	as well.
	
	lee
	
	
	Lee Schipper
	EMBARQ Fellow
	EMBARQ, the WRI Center for Sustainable Transport
	www.embarq.wri.org <http://www.embarq.wri.org/> 
	and
	Visiting Scholar
	UC Transportation Center
	Berkeley CA USA www.uctc.net <http://www.uctc.net/> 
	skype: mrmeter
	+1 510 642 6889
	Cell +1 202 262 7476
	 
	
	-----Original Message-----
	From: sustran-discuss-bounces+schipper=wri.org at list.jca.apc.org
	[mailto:sustran-discuss-bounces+schipper=wri.org at list.jca.apc.org] On
	Behalf Of bruun at seas.upenn.edu
	Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 12:17 PM
	To: sustran-discuss at list.jca.apc.org
	Subject: [sustran] Re: Tata Nano: Criminalizing Mobility or Mobilizing
	Crime
	
	Hassaan
	
	The reason people are alarmed is because they can see where this is
	going -- in the wrong direction against sustainable development and
	livable cities. But mostly the discussion in the press has been about
	fuel consumption, greenhouse gasses, and air pollution.
	
	One thing that has been under-reported is the consequences to
	pedestrians and biyclists. Far more are killed than motorists themselves
	in India. An increase in cars will increase the death and maiming to
	them far more than to motorists. But being piles of junk built to a very
	lax safety standard, these TATAs will no doubt be killing a lot of their
	users as well, and bring the ratio up.
	
	This negative impact will only be temporary. One of the things people
	haven't talked about in the press at all, as this is not as well known,
	is the sheer physical impossibility of accommodating so many cars.
	Within a short period of time, all the parking and road space within
	many cities will be used up and traffic will move to slowly to cause
	many serious accidents. Look at Chinese cities already, with only 2.5
	percent auto ownership.
	
	On the other hand, how can this be stopped? You are certainly right that
	the regulatory oversight is not yet in place. But if India's government
	works even remotely like the US government, the auto interests will be
	working behind the scenes to slow this oversight down as much as
	possible. If the rich are allowed to drive around, why can't other
	people? Until some restraints are put on cars in general, it would be
	class warfare to only ban these small cheap cars.
	
	Eric Bruun
	
	
	
	
	Quoting Hassaan Ghazali <hghazali at gmail.com>:
	
	> Friends,
	>
	> There was a time when a Model T rolled off the Ford assembly line 
	> every few seconds. I do believe that was probably the most exciting 
	> and the most positive time for the US economy. Now, it seems Tata's 
	> mobility breakthrough has everyone on the edge and I am surprised to 
	> see so many negative sentiments being expressed within South Asia. I 
	> don't remember so many issues abounding when Daimler-Chrysler's Smart 
	> car came out. Regardless of the fact that the Smart car was probably 
	> one major reason for the eventual divorce between Daimler and 
	> Chrysler, how does the economic and social disparity between the 
	> developed and developing world create the context to despise such an
	incredible product?
	>
	> Shall we all begin by shunning technology which aims to empower the 
	> masses or shall we encourage its uptake and ensure that the whole 
	> suite of technological constructs (institutions, policies, regulatory 
	> oversight,
	> etc.) are also provided.
	>
	> Regards,
	>
	> Hassaan
	>
	>
	> --
	> Institutional Development Specialist
	> Urban Sector Policy and Management Unit (The Urban Unit) Planning & 
	> Development Department, Government of the Punjab
	>
	> A: 4-B Lytton Road, Lahore, Pakistan
	> T: 9213579-84 (Ext.116)
	> F: 9213585
	> M: 0345 455 6016
	> Skype: halgazel
	> http://hghazali.googlepages.com <http://hghazali.googlepages.com/> 
	>
	> *When conditions are right, everything will go wrong*
	> --------------------------------------------------------
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