[sustran] Antwort: Re: CDM Projects (Clean Development Mechanism) - public tran

[Patrick.Daude at stuttgart.de]

Hi Todd,

thanks for your answer and your comments. At first view I understand that 
it might appear unusual the way these companies are involved in the 
network. But you should take into account that the automobile companies in 
Stuttgart have invested over the years enormous amounts of money in the 
development of environmentally-friendly technologies, also for public 
transport. Besides, Stuttgart and its region are traditionally linked to 
the topic of mobility. So when our city started "Cities for Mobility" we 
did not have to make a huge effort to convince these companies and the 
other actors to support the network. In the region of Stuttgart there is 
also a large number of research institutes and other organizations from 
the private sector that are active in the field of mobility and support 
our city. Stuttgart offers these actors a platform for establishing new 
contacts and exchanging experiences with their counterparts world wide. 

Contrary to other networks and international organisations, Cities for 
Mobility doesn't have any bureaucratic structure (like steering groups or 
committees) where these companies could take a decisive role in 
determining the strategy and topics of the network. If you have a look at 
our website, especially at our last World Congress (
http://www.cities-for-mobility.net/index.php?option=com_docman&task=cat_view&gid=93&Itemid=131) 
you will notice that the topics ranged from the promotion of bicycles and 
pedestrian to traffic management at mega events, motorized individual 
transport and public transport. So if we were making lobby for the 
automobile industry I would say that we are not doing a good job.

BR,
Patrick 


Coordinator Global Network "Cities for Mobility" 
City Hall of Stuttgart, Germany
Mayor's Policy Office
Policy Coordination and Planning
Rathaus, Marktplatz 1
D-70173 Stuttgart

Telephone: +49 711/ 216 - 85 01
Fax: +49 711/ 216 - 61 05
E-Mail: patrick.daude at stuttgart.de
Website: http://www.cities-for-mobility.org




"Todd Edelman, Green Idea Factory" <edelman at greenidea.eu> 
28.11.2008 12:33
Bitte antworten an
edelman at greenidea.eu


An
Patrick.Daude at stuttgart.de, Sustran Resource Centre 
<sustran-discuss at jca.apc.org>
Kopie
rothfuss at cities-for-mobility.net, N.Leyva at stuttgart.de, 
Wolfgang.Forderer at stuttgart.de
Thema
Re: [sustran] Re: CDM Projects (Clean Development Mechanism) - public tran




 

Hi Patrick, hi all,

I thank you for the invite to Stuttgart. I believe I understand how it 
works there, and I have been to a lot of  professional sustainable 
transport-related events, and I know people who attend CfM events. I have 
already explained my reasons for opting out, and will hopefully explain 
this more precisely in my delayed response to Rainer. Just one comment for 
now, see below.

Patrick.Daude at stuttgart.de wrote: 

Dear Todd, 

[...]

Our Premium Partners do note have any influence on the topics that are 
treated within the network. 

[...]

PLEASE, can you help explain their rationale for being involved? 
Successful businesses don't just randomly create and place imagery related 
to their brand and products. I may ask Rainer the same question - and I 
encourage others on this List etc. to answer it - but I will keep this 
email short.

Thanks,
T


Best wishes,
Patrick Daude 


Coordinator Global Network "Cities for Mobility" 
City Hall of Stuttgart, Germany
Mayor's Policy Office
Policy Coordination and Planning
Rathaus, Marktplatz 1
D-70173 Stuttgart

Telephone: +49 711/ 216 - 85 01
Fax: +49 711/ 216 - 61 05
E-Mail: patrick.daude at stuttgart.de
Website: http://www.cities-for-mobility.org

----- Weitergeleitet von Patrick Daude/OB-S/LHS/DE am 27.11.2008 11:30 
----- 
"pdaude78" <patrick.daude at stuttgart.de> 
Gesendet von: notify at yahoogroups.com 
27.11.2008 10:33 


An
patrick.daude at stuttgart.de, wolfgang.forderer at stuttgart.de, 
n.leyva at stuttgart.de 
Kopie

Thema
Fwd:  Re: [sustran] Re: CDM Projects (Clean Development Mechanism) - 
public tran






  

--- In Cities-for-Mobility at yahoogroups.com, "Dr. Rainer Rothfuss"
<rothfuss at ...> wrote:



  Dear Todd Edelmann,

  sorry for expressing myself so directly but your evaluation of 
"Cities for Mobility" has absolutely nothing to do with the reality:

  You say: "I am convinced that the whole project - no matter how 
inclusive-seeming - is in large part a greenwashing exercise for the 
Stuttgart-based automobile industry"

  CfM is a municipal initiative and we, as masterminds behind the 
network, feel 100% committed to greening urban mobility and not 
feeding any kind of industry. But, to be honest, without the money we 
receive from some private firms, including our local car producers, we 
could not work without membership fees and invite members from Africa, 
Asia and Latina America for free (other city networks charge 8.000 
Euros per year, no matter from where you are!).

  The companies that help us to finance the work of the Municipality 
of Stuttgart within the framework of CfM have agreed to give us their 
support without asking anything in return. There is not even a council 
or something where they could bring in their views or make their 
voices heard in order to influence the work of the network. To be 
honest, our somewhat depressing perception was that they don't even 
care about us as we, with our almost 500 partners from over 60 
countries, are not at all important for companies that have an annual 
turnover bigger than several small national economies together!!

  But, yes you are rigth, we also work on the topic of motorized 
individual mobility. But we don't tell anyone what Stuttgart's car 
makers would like to hear but just what we need in order to achieve 
real benefits for the environmental situation in cities. To cover 100% 
of all mobility demands by non-motorized mobility would be ideal - you 
may be right! But the fact is that motorized individual mobility will 
allways be there. So the crucial question is how we can green it (e.g. 
electric mobility with light vehicles and renewable energies - that's 
what we are dealing with in ongoing projects). We just dare facing 
this up to now inevitable motorized 90% share of the mobility reality 
that many others seem to ignore thinking that this way it will 
disappear... How about you?

  In general, I'm convinced it's better to go there and ask people 
what they think and want and really do before you judge them in 
public...

  But yes, I agree, it's good to have different platforms for working 
on the same issues. Each one will bring in new and valuable aspects. 
The big question for me just is whether we shall stick to a typical 
German way of thinking, I would say, that there is only one right 
answer and only one solution to such a complex problem and reality as 
is mobility, asking the rest of the world to obey, stop thinking and 
to follow it... So I'd be glad if you acknowledged also the value of 
the work we have been doing in the past years within CfM for the same 
cause as yours. Thanks!

  Regards,

  Rainer Rothfuss

-----------------------
Join the Cities for Mobility online forum:
http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/Cities-for-Mobility
Cities-for-Mobility-subscribe at yahoogroups.com
-----------------------

Dr. Rainer Rothfuss
Coordinator of International Relations
-----------------------
Coordination Office
Cities for Mobility
State Capital Stuttgart
-----------------------
Postal address:
D-70161 Stuttgart
GERMANY
Tel.: +49-8381-891-68 38
Fax: +49-8381-891-68 39
Mob: +49-177-894 08 04
Skype: rainer.rothfuss
rothfuss at ...
www.cities-for-mobility.netMessage from "Todd Edelman, Green Idea 
Factory" <edelman at ...>:

> Hi Aashish,
>
> This is an important question - which could perhaps include "Lots Less
> Cars" - and I am sure the three different
> administrator/co-administrators will answer it soon.
>
> For me it is clear that Sustran is about developing world/Global South
> issues. Very often the same messages go out on both New Mobility Cafe
> and Lots Less Cars, and while there are guidelines to make it simple
> for me what I usually do is if it something interesting and useful I
> send it to Lots Less and if even more exciting, revolutionary and
> important/critical I also send to New Mobility. And of course also to
> Sustran if applicable.
>
> I know that Eric works very hard at keeping the discussion lean and
> focused and while I sometimes object if a post I make - especially if
> I take a lot of time with it - is rejected, I see the reason for this.
> We can always post anything we want on our own Blogs, or of course
> start our own discussions.
>
> Sustran, New Mobility/Lots Less and Sustran also originate in three
> different institutions/entities, and perhaps some differences between
> them are fundamental. As for me, I do not participate in Cities for
> Mobility. It seems that the discussions held there could be useful but
> I am convinced that the whole project - no matter how inclusive-seeming
> - is in large part a greenwashing exercise for the Stuttgart-based
> automobile industry. Cities for Mobility has as one of its "mobility
> columns" the private urban car, and in (not just) my eyes this is Old
> Mobility and thus presents a fundamental difference from - and
> obviously a challenge to - the philosophy behind/purpose of the other
> lists.
>
> Regards,
> T
>
>
>
>
>
> Aashish Gupta wrote:
>> Dear Eric
>> I have gained much from the discussions at New moility cafe,
>> Cities-for-Mobility and sustrans. I have a suggestion. Cant we
integrate all
>> the lists, since all of them have a common focus. It would be much
easier,
>> as well as enlarge the discussion.
>>
>> Aashish Gupta
>> Department of Humanities and Social Sciences
>> Indian Institute of Technology Madras
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 4:06 PM, Eric Britton 
>> <eric.britton at ...>wrote:
>>
>>
>>> That's a good question Roland. I just tried Knoogling it and came
up with
>>> some interesting responses. You might wish to give it a try at
>>> http://knoogle.net . (And if you have suggestions for us as to
sources or
>>> other details to improve  its operation ,please do . . . Eric Britton
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Behalf Of Roland Sapsford
>>> Sent: Sunday, 23 November 2008 00:11
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> Is anyone aware of any work underway through the CDM, or in
negotiations
>>> around its successors, to make it easier for transport projects to be
>>> included.
>>>
>>> As far as I know, the only public transport project so far granted CDM
>>> credits is the TransMilenio busway in Bogota.  The main barrier is
that
>>> transport projects usually involve policy and planning changes as
well as
>>> projects, and the methodological tests for additionality are hard
to meet.
>>>
>>> Curiously yours
>>> Roland Sapsford
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Roland Sapsford
>>> Sustainability Solutions Consulting
>>>
>>> Climate Change, Cities, Energy, Transport
>>>
>>>
>>> PO Box 11-708, Manners St, Wellington 6142, New Zealand
>>> +64-4-9341106(w); +64-4-3851105(h); +64-21-651105(m)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Dr. Rainer Rothfuss wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> A través del instrumento CDM se pueden financiar proyectos para
reducir
>>> emisiones de CO2 - también en el área del transporte.
>>>
>>>
>>> Más informaciones: http://www.cdm-cooperation.de/7.0.html
>>>
>>> Para saber más del los proyectos ya implementados en los
diferentes países
>>> de América Latina hay que registrarse como usuario (gratuito).
>>>
>>>
>>> Clean Development Mechanism
>>>
>>>
>>> The Clean Development Mechanism (CDM) is a project-based
mechanism, laid
>>> down in the Kyoto Protocol within the United Nations Framework
Convention
>>> on
>>> Climate Change (UNFCCC <http://www.unfccc.int/> ) in 1997. On the one
>>> hand,
>>> it serves as a tool for the achievement of companies? or state?s
emission
>>> targets under minimum costs. On the other hand, it provides an
economic
>>> incentive for investments in technologies aiming at climate
protection.
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> Rainer Rothfuss
>>>
>>>
>>> -----------------------
>>> Join the Cities for Mobility online forum:
>>> http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/Cities-for-Mobility
>>>
Cities-for-Mobility-subscribe at yahoogroups.com<
http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/Cities-for-MobilityCities-for-Mobility-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
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>>>
>>> ================================================================
>>> SUSTRAN-DISCUSS is a forum devoted to discussion of people-centred,
>>> equitable and sustainable transport with a focus on developing
countries
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>>>
>>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------- IMPORTANT 
>> NOTE to everyone who gets sustran-discuss messages via 
>> YAHOOGROUPS.  Please go to 
>> http://list.jca.apc.org/manage/listinfo/sustran-discuss to join 
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>> yahoogroups version is only a mirror and 'members' there cannot 
>> post to the real sustran-discuss (even if the yahoogroups site 
>> makes it seem like you can). Apologies for the confusing arrangement.
>>
>> ================================================================
>> SUSTRAN-DISCUSS is a forum devoted to discussion of 
>> people-centred,  equitable and sustainable transport with a focus 
>> on developing  countries (the 'Global South').
>
>
> -- 
> --------------------------------------------
>
> Todd Edelman
> Green Idea Factory
>
> Urbanstr. 45
> D-10967 Berlin
> Germany
>
> Skype: toddedelman
> Mobile: ++49 0162 814 4081
> Home/Office: ++49 030 7554 0001
>
> edelman at ...
> www.greenidea.eu
> www.flickr.com/photos/edelman
>
> Green Idea Factory is a member of World Carfree Network
> www.worldcarfree.net
>
> CAR is over. If you want it.
>
> "Fort mit der Autostadt und was Neues hingebaut!" - B. Brecht (with
> slight modification)

--- End forwarded message ---












-- 
--------------------------------------------

Todd Edelman
Green Idea Factory

Urbanstr. 45
D-10967 Berlin
Germany

Skype: toddedelman
Mobile: ++49 0162 814 4081
Home/Office: ++49 030 7554 0001

edelman at greenidea.eu
www.greenidea.eu
www.flickr.com/photos/edelman

Green Idea Factory is a member of World Carfree Network
www.worldcarfree.net

CAR is over. If you want it.

"Fort mit der Autostadt und was Neues hingebaut!" 
- B. Brecht (with slight modification)




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