[sustran] Re: BRTS in Delhi

[bruun at seas.upenn.edu]

Aashish

Thanks for the ridership figure. (I think the 65 km is out of date. It  
was 66 kms 3 years ago.)

The reason I was asking is that Sujit said the ridership was  
"abysmal." But 600,000 persons for 66 kms is actually pretty crowded.  
The Washington Metro is 105 miles (over 160 kms) and several of the  
lines are genuinely crush loaded during the rush hours with only  
700,000 passengers per day. Admittedly, people in the U.S. tend to be  
larger than in India, which also aggravates the crowding.

As for an estimate of 3.1 Million, this seems ridiculous. Of course,  
it isn't going to meet that. Maybe if the fare was assumed to be very  
low and crowding standards were extreme......

Eric





Quoting Sujit Patwardhan <sujitjp at gmail.com>:

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Sujit Patwardhan <sujitjp at gmail.com>
> Date: Fri, Apr 25, 2008 at 1:08 PM
> Subject: Re: [pttfgen:1409] BRTS in Delhi
> To: pttfgen at googlegroups.com
>
>
> 25 April 2008
>
>
> BRT in Delhi
> =========
>
> Yes problems galore and I've been following the reports in the media
> including the CNN IBN that Ashok Datar was to appear on, but didn't for some
> reason.
>
> My take on all this is as follows:
>
> Deterioration in traffic has been an ongoing process in many Asian cities
> for the last 3 decades or more. Like the frog sitting in a beaker of water
> being slowly heated it has not had an occasion to "explode". Metro was taken
> up and executed brilliantly by Mr. E Sridharan, with attention to the
> minutest detail and a free hand guaranteeing "no interference" from
> politicians. On top of that every lapse and overshooting of budgets as well
> as abysmally poor ridership compared to the projected figures was pardoned
> by a supportive Govt and compensated from additional funds made available
> without delay and cloaked in secrecy.
>
> *Delhi Metro project is a marketing triumph that fills every Indian's chest
> with pride*. However, how much travel-coverage (as Public Transport) the
> very expensive Metro will be able to provide is a big question mark. There
> is also the real possibility that the amount spent on the Metro represents
> lost opportunity for other investments - like libraries and cultural
> centres, gardens, public spaces and other amenities needed by the city. *But
> in the final analysis we should accept that the Metro is pubic transport and
> hence we must support it* unlike the eight lane highways, flyovers,
> multistory car parks and other infrastructures being *routinely provided by
> the city as subsidy to ever growing number of car and 2 wheeler owners at
> the cost of other more efficient modes of travel.*
>
> BRT unlike the Metro has to deal with the existing conditions on our roads.
> Of indiscipline, rampant irregularities, encroachments, poor engineering,
> lack of understanding about the rights of pedestrians, cyclists and non
> personal auto users. So if the road surface is poor BRT is blamed, if
> drivers are indisciplined  BRT is blamed, if a car stalls in the MV lane and
> clogs up the traffic it is perceived as a problem caused by the BRT. If the
> BRT lanes look empty (as indeed they will - considering each bus carries
> many more people), it is seen as  waste of an expensive resource -- although
> not many of these critics complained much all these years about the *wasteful
> use of resources when low occupancy cars filled up these very roads* - well
> before BRT appeared on the scene.
>
> So it is clear that BRT planning should have been rooted in outreach and
> marketing it as a concept that will improve mobility (of people as against
> just near-empty personal vehicles),  will greatly improve access for people
> who are today helpless captive users of uncomfortable and outdated buses, it
> will provide an option to those who are forced to use personal transport,
> not necessarily out of choice but compulsion, and as benefits of a growing
> BRT network becomes visible and better, more comfortable and even A/C buses
> start plying on the BRT corridors, the higher middle class and even the rich
> will have no problem patronizing this mode for purely rational reasons of
> getting a faster, more punctual, comfortable and stress-free mode of travel.
>
>
> This indeed is the situation in many cities in Europe and while we have no
> qualms about importing western concepts  (English medium education, wearing
> suits and tie however uncomfortable they may be in our weather, listening to
> western music, eating the big Mac (ughhh) and even importing Cheerleaders
> for our newly formed Cricket Series) why do we suddenly start protesting
> when our capital city tries to copy a Western/ Latin American idea of
> excellent bus system/BRT calling it a foreign concept??????
>
> The need is to publicise wider benefits of public transport and to reach the
> *majority *of citizens who are users/potential users of *bus based public
> transport, cycling and walking* in the city. (It is they who will benefit
> most from a good BRT)
>
> It is this huge majority of commuters who will have the opportunity of
> breaking free from the shackles of our present horrendous conditions of
> urban traffic.
>
> So let's not worry too much about the high pitched screams coming from the
> pampered lot of car users (and to some extent from two wheelers) protesting
> against dedicated BRT lanes taking away *their* road space, and let's reach
> the gagged-majority who have been at the receiving end of the stick ever
> since our cities became car-dominated *and if necessary bring them on the
> roads to block the MV lanes and put the personal cars in their place.
>
> *Does this sound extreme? Not when contrasted with the obscene arrogant rant
> coming from Mr Chandan Mitra -  representing the car lobby/media/politician
> clique on the recent CNN IBN TV report about the mess accompanying the BRT
> trials in Delhi.
>
> --
> Sujit
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 25, 2008 at 10:35 AM, Abhay Patil <abhay.patil at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Looks like BRTS in Delhi has reached a flash point.  From the visuals (CNN
>> IBN, newspapers) it looks like Delhi's implementation is no better than
>> Pune.  Empty BRTS lanes, sloppy junctions, ordinary bus stops and so on.  I
>> don't know what went amiss in the capital.  Sheila Dixit has promised that
>> she would make an all out effort to remove the glitches in a few weeks.
>> Most important - she has said that she would not hesitate to drop the
>> project if they are unable to get their act together right away.
>>
>> On a positive note - everybody is looking at BRTS now.  On a negative note
>> - it is appears to be quite a tall order to fix it.  Given the ugly traffic
>> jams and vociferousness of folks like journalist MP Chandan Mitra - it is
>> quite likely that the baby would be thrown out with the bath water! And,
>> that would have serious repercussions on BRTS in other cities.  I can not
>> imagine the cacophony that would ensue once that happens...
>>
>> -Abhay
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
> --
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Sujit Patwardhan
> sujitjp at gmail.com
>
> "Yamuna",
> ICS Colony,
> Ganeshkhind Road,
> Pune 411 007
> India
> Tel: +91 20 25537955
> Cell: +91 98220 26627
> -----------------------------------------------------
> Hon. Secretary:
> Parisar
> www.parisar.org
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Founder Member:
> PTTF
> (Pune Traffic & Transportation Forum)
> www.pttf.net
> ------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> --
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Sujit Patwardhan
> sujitjp at gmail.com
>
> "Yamuna",
> ICS Colony,
> Ganeshkhind Road,
> Pune 411 007
> India
> Tel: +91 20 25537955
> Cell: +91 98220 26627
> -----------------------------------------------------
> Hon. Secretary:
> Parisar
> www.parisar.org
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Founder Member:
> PTTF
> (Pune Traffic & Transportation Forum)
> www.pttf.net
> ------------------------------------------------------
> --------------------------------------------------------
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