[sustran] Re: Is E.B. patronizing, offensive, heavy handed and counter-productive? Re: Driving in Bangalore / India -

Eric Bruun ericbruun at earthlink.net
Sat Aug 26 03:45:13 JST 2006


Daryl

If I may interject here. I can't speak for others, but I certainly don't automatically dismiss concepts like 
the ETT. But until the financing is found for a demonstration project that proves the transportation value, I am on the side of agencies that continue to use proven technologies. This is the only responsible course. Most public agencies don't have a large research fund and look to higher levels of governments or NGO to do the proving.

Eric Bruun


-----Original Message-----
>From: Daryl Oster <et3 at et3.com>
>Sent: Aug 25, 2006 11:47 AM
>To: eric.britton at ecoplan.org, 'Global 'South' Sustainable Transport' <sustran-discuss at list.jca.apc.org>
>Subject: [sustran] Is E.B. patronizing, offensive,	heavy handed and counter-productive? Re: Driving in Bangalore / India	-
>
>
>
>> Original Message From: Eric Britton
>> Subject: [sustran] Driving in Bangalore / India - patronizing,
>> offensive,heavy handed and counter-productive
>> 
>> No, not "excellent" at all. Sorry but I do not think this is very funny.
>> It does no good and illuminates nothing useful
>> 
>
>Eric, the piece is a very good observation of reality, and I agree with you
>that while good, it is not excellent.  The piece IS funny, and it is
>illuminating, to be useful and therefore "excellent", there must be some
>suggestions at possible improvement.  To point out a problem without
>suggesting a solution is complaining.  
>
> 
>> To the contrary I find it patronizing, offensive, heavy handed and
>> counter-productive. (After all we are here for a reason, aren't we? Or is
>> it all about guffawing at the feckless 'natives' for their primitive ways?
>> Someone help me here.) .
>
>Complaining is a good start, you seem quite good at complaining about cars!
>(and you forget they are hear for many good reasons) Your complaint of the
>few problems of cars is a good start, AND you also suggest what you believe
>to be a "solution".  IMO, the "solution" you suggest (car-free cities) is
>"patronizing, offensive, heavy handed, and counter-productive ... <and is>
>all about guffawing at the feckless 'natives' for their primitive ways".
>
> 
>> I do not think that this alpha, rather puerile and distinctly uncultured
>> piece belongs here. I see it as a dinner piece for a group of hearty
>> guffawing colonials after their fifth beer.
>> 
>> (I guess that some of you are not going to invite me to your next white
>> man's party, eh?)
>
>To you self incriminating list, we may now add "racist", and "presumptuous".
>
>
>
>> 
>> Eric Britton (And here I am pleased to give anyone who does not like what
>> I say here my full contact information so that you can mail, call or come
>> here and look me in the eye and tell me what you think of me and my views.
>> I live on the fifth floor, door to the right of the elevator.
>> With all good wishes
>> Eric Britton
>
>Eric,
>One of the things I most respect about you is do not hide your contact
>information; that is a mark of integrity often lacking in forums of this
>type.  I hope you have the courage there in your fifth floor Paris apartment
>to look yourself in the mirror and examine how your words and actions might
>appear to the "feckless 'natives'" that you are attempting to cure from
>"their primitive ways" from afar by taking away their cars, while you enjoy
>yours.
>
>BTW, I thought Alan's comment about the lack of use of mirrors was
>brilliant!
>
>My suggestion for improving the "problem" aptly pointed out in the
>well-written and honest piece you object to is:
>
>The solutions are education AND strict enforcement of reasoned rules, and
>this must be of vehicle users of all types AND pedestrians.  I believe (but
>offer no proof) that if ALL traffic on a few representational streets,
>alleys, sidewalks, etc. in the city were to be strictly and completely
>enforced at ALL times to observe the law, that the users of the orderly
>street would quickly learn that it is in their best interests to obey
>reasoned rules even where they are not strictly enforced. 
>
>Research shows that to reach a critical mass, it only takes about 1 or 2
>percent adoption of a new way that is better for most people.  The problem I
>see with your "car free" solution is that it seeks to go against what is in
>the best interest of most people -- and this has already been proven, as
>what you are really suggesting is to return to the old way of trains,
>busses, and bikes that is no longer sustainable against the superior value
>of car and airplane transportation.  What puzzles me, and many other
>transportation experts is why you object to solutions (like ETT) that offer
>greater transportation value than cars and jets, without their problems of
>lack of energy and environmental sustainability; AND without the even
>greater sustainability problems associated with muscle powered and train
>transport.   
>
>Best regards,
>
>Daryl Oster
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