[sustran] Re: [NewMobilityCafe] Re: Segway is environmental orsustainable?

[Walter Hook]

The inventor of the Segway, Dean Kamen, came to ITDP and Transportation alternatives a year or so ago.  He  is the well known inventor of this famous wheelchair that can climb stairs.  I was ready to be supportive of the thing, and thought these guys might be good allies for traffic calmed streets and high quality grade separated cycling facilities, where they would in my opinion operate reasonably compatably with bicycles.i had him crash it into me to see what it was like, and it was like being hit by a person jogging, not like being hit by a vehicle, certainly no worse than being hit by a cyclist.  So it seems to me that the regulatory system should treat them the same way bicycles are treated.  I see no difficulty using them on suburban sidewalks which are relatively under-utilized.  But certainly they don't belong on New York City sidewalks, which are extremely overcrowded in many areas.  

the biggest problem is with Dean Kamen and the Segway company that he owns entirely.  He insists that they are unsafe for use on streets in any conditions and is adamant that they belonged only on the sidewalks.  As such, he sees no common cause with cyclists, and he has put himself on a collision course with pedestrian advocates and some advocates for the disabled.  It is as if he has decided that it is easier politically to steam roller pedestrian groups and grab scarce sidewalk space than it is to beat the highway lobby and grab road space for bicycles and segways, or to win traffic calming, so they decided to pick on the weaker guys.  His attitude was so arrogant and insulting, "Who voted for you guys," he asked.  Our five thousand members," we said.  "five thousand?  That's nothing," he said.  The strong arm tacticts of his lobbyists so bare knuckled, that he alienated virtually all of us bike ped advocates.  

Well, TA's 5000 members managed to beat him in Albany and keep them illegal on new york city sidewalks.   In parts of the outer boroughs, this is probably too bad, but in Manhattan and busy parts of brooklyn and queens, this is a good thing. 

best
walter 


Walter Hook, Ph.D.
Executive Director
Institute for Transportation and Development Policy (ITDP)
127 West 26th Street, Suite 1003
New York, NY 10001
Ph:  (212) 629-8001
Fax: (212) 629-8033
 
Promoting environmentally sustainable and equitable transportation worldwide
 
Visit http://www.itdp.org
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Elizabeth Deakin 
  To: NewMobilityCafe at yahoogroups.com ; Asia and the Pacific sustainable transport ; 'Asia and the Pacific sustainable transport' ; carfree_network at lists.riseup.net ; NewMobilityCafe at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2005 10:36 AM
  Subject: [sustran] Re: [NewMobilityCafe] Re: Segway is environmental orsustainable?


  My elderly neighbor who was quite athletic for most of his life now has limited ability to walk. His Segway has made it possible for him to continue his activities including taking care of his animals, fruit trees, etc. I think we should be careful about sweeping judgments. (I hate Segways on sidewalks in cities, too...but this use is life-sustaining.)

  Betty Deakin


  -----Original Message----- 
  From: Eric Bruun 
  Sent: Jun 7, 2005 7:26 PM 
  To: Asia and the Pacific sustainable transport , 'Asia and the Pacific sustainable transport' , carfree_network at lists.riseup.net, NewMobilityCafe at yahoogroups.com 
  Subject: [NewMobilityCafe] Re: [sustran] Segway is environmental or sustainable? 


  Carlos

  The Segway people have done an incredible lobbying and publicity gathering job. They managed to get state laws changed to permit Segways on sidewalks (pavements) in 30+ states in the US, mostly without public input. In Philadelphia it is now illegal to ride a bicycle on a sidewalk if you are over 12 years old, but riding a Segway is fine. A Segway rep also showed up with one at one of our Transportation Research Board committtee meetings a couple of years back. I think Segway is also lobbying the military to buy them. The president of the company is a lifelong conservative Republican if I recall, so it seems pretty insincere if he is trying to pitch an environmental argument. 

  This 1/4th mile "rule" is really just an approximation that doesn't pertain for longer trips, or for accessing high-quality transit, or for communities where walking is pleasant and it is part of the culture to walk. 

  I think that Segways might have some use in an industrial setting to replace golf carts and other larger electrical vehicles, but I agree with you about their use for the general public. 

  Eric Bruun


  -----Original Message----- 
  From: "Carlos F. Pardo" 
  Sent: Jun 7, 2005 5:29 PM 
  To: 'Asia and the Pacific sustainable transport' , carfree_network at lists.riseup.net, NewMobilityCafe at yahoogroups.com 
  Subject: [sustran] Segway is environmental or sustainable? 


  I just found this article in an environmental magazine and I was shocked. It says that Segways are one of the most environmentally friendly modes of transportation, and it even states the following:

   "There are a lot of statistics that show that if people are forced to walk more than a fourth of a mile to connect to transit, then they will just get in their cars," says Carla Vallone, communications manager for Segway LLC. "The Segway HT is another option for people who may not want to ride their bikes." 

  I think segways are one of the worst ideas that have ever been developed in the past few years. They encourage lazy people to become lazier by giving them an expensive apparatus that will only make them occupy more space on sidewalks and stop using their bodies as a main source of mobility. It's just sad to see these opinions walk through into the "environmental discourse without being noticed. Maybe in a few more years many people will be promoting the use of segways instead of bicycles or walking!

  The entire article is available in the following address: http://www.emagazine.com/view/?2488 

   

   

  Carlos F. Pardo

  Project Coordinator

  GTZ Sustainable Urban Transport Project (SUTP)

  Room 0942, Transport Division, UN-ESCAP

  ESCAP UN Building

  Rajadamnern Nok Rd.

  Bangkok 10200, Thailand

  Tel: +66 (0) 2 - 288 2576

  Fax: +66 (0) 2 - 280 6042

  Mobile: +66 (0) 1 - 772 4727

  e-mail: carlos.pardo at sutp.org

  Website: www.sutp.org

   



  The New Mobility Agenda is permanently at http://NewMobility.org 
  To post messages to list: NewMobilityCafe at yahoogroups.com
  To unsubscribe: NewMobilityCafe-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
  Free group video/voice-conferencing via http://newmobilitypartners.org 







------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  Yahoo! Groups Links

    a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NewMobilityCafe/
      
    b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    NewMobilityCafe-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
      
    c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. 



Professor, Dept. of City and Regional Planning
Director, UC Transportation Center
2614 Dwight Way MC 1782
University of California
Berkeley CA 94720-1782
tel 510 642-4749

------------------------------------------------------------------------------




  ================================================================
  SUSTRAN-DISCUSS is a forum devoted to discussion of people-centred, equitable and sustainable transport with a focus on developing countries (the 'Global South'). Because of the history of the list, the main focus is on urban transport policy in Asia.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://list.jca.apc.org/manage/private/sustran-discuss/attachments/20050613/59b9c8e4/attachment-0001.html