[sustran] Re: Information on 'Bike Taxi'

[Craig Townsend]

I would like to add a few points to this great discussion:

1. This discussion is being carried out based on observations rather than 
systematic or empirical research, thus it is hard to assess any claim such 
as motorcycles contribute more/less than other modes to the use of energy, 
fatalities, etc, in a given city in comparison with other cities or within 
a city. If anyone knows of such research, references would help the 
discussion. Some data collected on Asian cities indicate that petrol use in 
Bangkok is higher per capita than in any other city surveyed in Asia 
(including Tokyo, Singapore, Hong Kong), so it would be hard to argue that 
the proliferation of motorcycles has contributed to energy efficiency of 
the transport system as a whole (although perhaps in outer suburban areas 
they may be better than buses).

2. Motorcycles are a mode catering to individual travel and are hence less 
useful than some other modes to activities involving travel by multiple 
individuals and individuals carrying things. In some cities this could 
translate into a bias against women who are often responsible for looking 
after children and carrying goods (while men may be doing more individual 
commuting to and from the workplace). Empirical data on sex and motorcycle 
use would help.

3. It is hard to know whether Thailand's particular class system is a cause 
or a consequence of transport conditions. (i.e. are non-motorized transport 
conditions poor because the users of that infrastructure are people with 
low social status or are they forced to use that infrastructure because 
they have low social status?) One argument for the proposition that 
"non-motorized transport conditions are poor because the users of that 
infrastructure are people with low social status" is that high status 
people in Bangkok do walk, but it is in air conditioned, privatized spaces 
such as shopping malls. (This activity is not picked up in the travel 
survey data.) Also, a large and growing segment of the upper middle class 
and wealthy social strata in Bangkok now pay to walk on treadmills! (See 
the second floor health club at the intersection of Soi Convent and Silom 
Road!)

4. While the heat and humidity certainly make walking outside in Bangkok 
uncomfortable and tiring, I don't believe they are sufficient to explain 
the remarkably low levels of walking recorded in travel surveys. In other 
cities such as Singapore where it is a little hotter and more humid people 
(both foreign visitors and locals) walk a lot more than in Bangkok 
(although probably far less than they would if sidewalk conditions and 
distances were the same but the temperature was significantly cooler). A 
danger in the argument given by many people in Thailand that they are 
culturally-programmed not to walk (and that their culture cannot change) is 
that no attempt is made to provide decent public sidewalks or even to halt 
the continuing deterioration in quality and quantity. The only significant 
recent sidewalk improvement measures in Bangkok have been undertaken in 
areas catering for rich locals and tourists or in areas linked to luxury 
shopping centres.

Best regards,

Craig Townsend


At 09:12 AM 24/08/2004, you wrote:
>Hallo,
>I am fully agree with Karl about the issue of walkway occupancy by MC Taxi.
>But I have here discussions as follows:
>1. There is no consideration of government and experts about the intermodal
>facilities between MC taxi and Public transport.
>2. No concern about where should be the park or waiting place for MC taxi
>while most of the activities centers have taxi waiting area.
>3. Regarding the trip length: we should consider the weather conditions in
>Bangkok or Hanoi, it is different from most of European countries. So, the
>ASEAN people may do not want to walk on this condition.
>4. If we have no MC taxi, It would be worse if 10% the passengers will use
>the PC, 40% will use the PC-taxi, even the rest 50%  will use the NMV for
>their paratransit trip.
>Sincerely,
>HUNG
> > One of the downsides is that motorcycle taxis tend to lounge around and
> > park
> > on walkways, and ride on walkways for at least part of their journey,
> > honking aggressively to clear away those bothersome pedestrians. Further,
> > the areas they congregate in tend to be more concentrated areas of
> > pedestrian activity such as major bus stops, markets, etc. In Bangkok it's
> > common for them to cordon off areas near a bus stop to the detriment of
> > waiting bus passengers - e.g. in front of Pata Pinklao. Not to mention the
> > noise and air pollution they contribute, often in areas with lots of
> > people
> > which already suffer noise and air pollution (there's been an interesting
> > debate on noise pollution recently in Bangkok following data released by
> > the
> > Env Ministry).
> >
> > Another consideration is that many of the motorcylce taxi trips in Bangkok
> > are within an easy walking distance - if only there was a navigable,
> > pleasant walkway. If conditions for short distance trips by walking were
> > improved, the demand for motorcycle taxis would diminish. Also, where
> > trips
> > are too long to walk, bicycles could easily substitute for motorcycle
> > taxis
> > for many trips, if only secure parking areas and other forms of
> > encouragement were provided for cycling. Such measures need not cost a
> > lot.
> >
> > But there seems to be little interesting in encouraging alternatives to
> > motorcycle taxis, and this leads to the point that the motorcycle taxi
> > industry is also a major contributor to corruption, by most estimates
> > contributing tens of millions of dollars each year in pay-offs to police
> > and
> > others. It's great to have these motorcycle taxi services in outlying
> > areas
> > where otherwise no other service might be available, but the real issue is
> > their presence in congested urban areas. They can play a valuable role as
> > Jonathan outlines. However, at least in Bangkok which I'm more familiar
> > with, encouraging walking and cycling and improved bus routings as an
> > alternative to motorcycle taxis wherever possible, and strictly
> > prohibiting
> > motorcycle taxis from parking or driving on walkways, would have many
> > benefits.
> >
> > Regards, Karl
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: sustran-discuss-bounces+karl=dnet.net.id at list.jca.apc.org
> > [mailto:sustran-discuss-bounces+karl=dnet.net.id at list.jca.apc.org] On
> > Behalf
> > Of Jonathan E. D. Richmond
> > Sent: Monday, 23 August 2004 11:18 PM
> > To: Asia and the Pacific sustainable transport
> > Subject: [sustran] Re: Information on 'Bike Taxi'
> >
> >
> > It is a mistake to assume that official public transport will necessarily
> > result in the consumption of less fuel than motorbike taxis or that it can
> > replace them in many instances. A bike operating on demand in a suburban
> > area can be considerably more efficient than buses circulating most of the
> > day almost empty.
> >
> > In fact, many motorbike services do operate as public transport --
> > charging
> > about the same fare but providing a level of frequency not possible with
> > buses. For low-income people living in outlying suburbs, there may be no
> > alternative if density is inufficient for more formal operations -- in
> > fact,
> > in many cases, the bikes actually operate from bus stops and provide
> > services to locations not served by buses.
> >
> > So we have to be careful about making generalizations.
> >
> > Note that in my case the alternative to taking a motorbike, which I
> > frequently use to complete a journey after a bus or train ride, would be
> > to
> > take a regular taxi for the whole journey as it would simply take too long
> > otherwise.
> >
> >                                             --jonathan
> >
> > -----
> >
> > Jonathan E. D. Richmond                               02 524-5510 (office)
> > Visiting Fellow                               Intl.: 662 524-5510
> > Transportation Engineering program
> > School of Civil Engineering, Room N260B               02 524-8257 (home)
> > Asian Institute of Technology                 Intl.: 662 524-8257
> > PO Box 4
> > Klong Luang, Pathumthani 12120                        02 524-5509 (fax)
> > Thailand                                      Intl:  662 524-5509
> >
> > e-mail: richmond at ait.ac.th               Secretary:  Ms. Nisarat Hansuksa
> >         richmond at alum.mit.edu                       02 524-6051
> >                                             Intl:  662 524-6051
> > http://the-tech.mit.edu/~richmond/
> >
> >
> >
>
>--
>****************************************
>Khuat Viet Hung, M.Eng
>(C/o: Prof. Manfred Boltze)
>Institut fuer Verkehr, TU Darmstadt
>Petersenstrasse 30, 64287 Darmstadt, Deutschland
>Tel. : + 49-6151-16 2026
>Fax:  + 49-6151-16 2045
>
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